The Jewish roots of Christianity

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Series: “Revelation”
It grows more and more difficult to make programs on End Times prophecy. Events threaten to overtake the relatively slower speed of television production. This series will provide a real “revelation” to those who want to be informed about the onward march of Islam and the oncoming Tribulation Period. Zola’s guests are ex-Palestinian terrorists Ibrahim Abdullah and Walid Shoebat.
Episode: “35 Life Sentences” with Walid Shoebat
We continue with our interviews in a high-security prison located in Beer Sheva, Israel. Walid Shoebat once again draws from his own background in refuting the claims of Hamas members. One of the convicted terrorists has been given 35 consecutive lifetime sentences for masterminding one of the most devastating suicide bombings in history.

Caption transcript for Revelation: “35 Life Sentences” with Walid Shoebat (5/6)

  • 00:39 SHALOM, HELLO AGAIN.
  • 00:41 WALID SHOEBAT IS BACK WITH US.
  • 00:43 WE THANK HIM FOR COMING BY.
  • 00:46 THIS IS A SPECIAL PROGRAM LIKE LAST WEEK'S,
  • 00:49 WHERE KEN, OUR PRODUCER, KEN BERG,
  • 00:51 INTERVIEWED SOME PALESTINIAN PRISONERS AND LET THEM AIR THEIR GRIEVANCES
  • 00:56 AND WE HAVE WALID HERE WHO HIMSELF WAS A PALESTINIAN TERRORIST.
  • 01:02 HE IS NOW A CONVERTED CHRISTIAN.
  • 01:04 BUT HE WILL COMMENT ON WHAT THEY SAY.
  • 01:07 WE'RE GOING TO A LOCATION NEAR BEER-SHEVA, ISRAEL.
  • 01:11 AND WE'LL CONTINUE WITH FOOTAGE FROM THE PRISON.
  • 01:15 KEN IS INTERVIEWING THE PRISONERS AND YOU CAN MONITOR THIS FOR YOURSELF.
  • 01:22 ISRAEL'S BEER-SHEVA PRISON IS ALSO KNOWN AS AL HADIM KADAR PRISON, THE TENTS OF KADAR,
  • 01:29 BECAUSE IT WAS HERE THAT ABRAHAM WOULD LIKELY HAVE PITCHED HIS TENTS SOME 3900 YEARS AGO.
  • 01:35 THE PRISON IS SURROUNDED BY HEAVILY FORTIFIED WALLS,
  • 01:38 WATCH TOWERS AND ELECTRIC FENCE, BARBED WIRE AND WATCH DOGS.
  • 01:42 THERE ARE ABOUT 2,000 INMATES HERE, OF WHICH 1,500 ARE CONVICTED TERRORISTS.
  • 01:47 TO LOOK AT HIM YOU'D NEVER GUESS THAT ABBAS AL SAYYED, THE PRISONER YOU'RE ABOUT TO MEET,
  • 01:53 HAS BEEN SENTENCED TO HUNDREDS OF YEARS.
  • 01:56 CLEAN SHAVEN AND NATTILY ATTIRED, HE'S BEEN CONVICTED OF COORDINATING 2 SUICIDE BOMBINGS,
  • 02:01 RESULTING IN THE DEATHS OF 35 PEOPLE.
  • 02:04 I AM THE YOUNGEST SON OF MY FAMILY.
  • 02:08 MY FAMILY IS HERE SINCE THOUSANDS OF YEARS.
  • 02:14 WE LIVE IN TUL KARIM.
  • 02:15 I AM AN ENGINEER.
  • 02:17 I GOT MY B.A. IN MECHANICAL ENGINEERING FROM JORDAN.
  • 02:22 I GOT A SCHOLARSHIP TO SPECIALIZE IN BIOMEDICAL ENGINEERING IN USA.
  • 02:28 IT WAS AT EMORY UNIVERSITY IN ATLANTA GEORGIA, BETWEEN 1991 TO 1992.
  • 02:35 (KEN) AND WHY ARE YOU HERE?
  • 02:37 I WAS A MEMBER OF THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE
  • 02:41 ON THE ACCUSATION OF OPPOSING OCCUPATION.
  • 02:46 I WAS ARRESTED AND I AM HERE.
  • 02:48 SO WE HAVE NOW 9,000 PALESTINIAN SECURITY PRISONERS INSIDE THE ISRAELI PRISONS.
  • 02:56 ALL OF THEM ARE BECAUSE OF THE OCCUPATION.
  • 02:58 IT IS DIFFERENT FROM ONE DETAINEE TO ANOTHER,
  • 03:02 BUT ALL OF US ARE HERE ONLY BECAUSE OF OPPOSING OR FIGHTING OCCUPATION.
  • 03:11 LIKE MOST OF THE PRISONERS, ABBAS IS IN DENIAL OF WHAT HE'S DONE,
  • 03:14 WHILE REVELING IN THE DEADLY AFTERMATH.
  • 03:17 HE AND HIS ACCOMPLICES HAVE, IN FACT, BEEN SENTENCED TO 29 LIFE TERMS
  • 03:22 FOR MASTERMINDING THE PASSOVER SUICIDE BOMBING AT THE PARK HOTEL
  • 03:27 IN THE COASTAL CITY OF NETANYA IN 2002 AND THE SHARON SHOPPING MALL IN 2001.
  • 03:39 WE ARE FREEDOM FIGHTERS.
  • 03:41 WE CONSIDER OURSELVES AS THIS.
  • 03:44 OUR ARABIC NATION CONSIDERS US AS THIS.
  • 03:47 THERE IS NO DEBATE IF THE PALESTINIAN FACTIONS ARE LEADERS OR TERRORISTS.
  • 03:53 ALL THE ARAB PEOPLE OR THE MUSLIMS ALL OVER THE WORLD SEE US AS,
  • 04:00 THE MAJORITY OF THE MUSLIMS ALL OVER THE WORLD SEE US AS FREEDOM FIGHTERS
  • 04:04 AND WE DO BELIEVE THAT IT COINCIDES WITH THE INTERNATIONAL LAW.
  • 04:10 IT'S NOT A NEW THING TO OPPOSE OCCUPATION AND IT'S NOT ANY KIND OF OCCUPATION.
  • 04:15 IT'S AN EXCEPTIONAL OCCUPATION.
  • 04:17 IT TOOK A VERY LONG TIME.
  • 04:19 IT TRANSFERRED OUR GRANDFATHER'S FROM THEIR HOMELAND
  • 04:25 AND THE SITUATION IS GETTING WORSE AND WORSE EVERY YEAR AND THE YEAR AFTER.
  • 04:32 SO THIS IS THE SITUATION.
  • 04:33 WE ARE FREEDOM FIGHTERS.
  • 04:35 AND THOSE WHO PARTICIPATE IN THE OPPOSING OR ARE STRUGGLING AGAINST OCCUPATION
  • 04:44 USUALLY THEY ARE EDUCATED.
  • 04:47 THEY KNOW WHAT THEY DID.
  • 04:49 THEY FELT THAT IT IS A DUTY TO DO WHAT THEY DID.
  • 04:52 WELL, THIS GUY IS A REAL KINGPIN AND YOU CAN SAY A LOT ABOUT HIM.
  • 04:56 BUT YOU KNOW THE THING HE SAYS AND REPEATS IS, HE'S A "FREEDOM FIGHTER".
  • 05:00 THIS TERMINOLOGY IS ALWAYS USED, "FREEDOM FIGHTER".
  • 05:05 WE DON'T SEE ANY MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR.
  • 05:07 IN THE PALESTINIAN AREAS ASKING FOR FREEDOM FOR ANYTHING, FOR ANY SORT.
  • 05:10 WELL THAT'S RIGHT.
  • 05:11 THERE'S NO MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR.
  • 05:13 AND THE PALESTINIANS ARE PERFECTLY FREE.
  • 05:15 IF THEY WOULDN'T CROSS A LINE AND GO KILL SOMEBODY IN A PASSOVER SERVICE,
  • 05:19 I MEAN THE ISRAELIS WOULD, WOULD, THEY'D BE DECENT, GOOD TO THEM.
  • 05:24 YOU KNOW, I'VE ALWAYS THOUGHT, THE COUNTRIES THAT COOPERATED TO WHATEVER SMALL DEGREE,
  • 05:29 JORDAN SAY, WITH ISRAEL, PROSPER.
  • 05:32 OF COURSE THEY PROSPER, IT'S A GOING DEMOCRACY.
  • 05:34 YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY MEAN BY "FREEDOM FIGHTER".
  • 05:37 BEING FREE IS BEING FREE FROM JEWISH PRESENCE IN THAT LAND.
  • 05:41 THIS IS WHY IN GAZA, WHEN THE FIGHTING OVER GAZA,
  • 05:45 THEY WANT THE JEWISH COMMUNITIES TO DISMANTLE THEIR COMMUNITIES AND MOVE OUT.
  • 05:48 IN GAZA. >>IT'S IRONIC.
  • 05:50 I MEAN, SUPPOSEDLY I'VE ALWAYS HEARD THAT WE REMOVE THE THUGS FROM THE COMMUNITY.
  • 05:54 THIS WAY WE REMOVE THE COMMUNITY AND GIVE THE LAND TO THE THUGS.
  • 05:59 THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT IT WAS. >>IT'S AMAZING.
  • 06:01 AND WHEN YOU RESPOND TO IT, THEN IT'S A CYCLE OF VIOLENCE - THE CYCLE OF VIOLENCE.
  • 06:05 YOU KNOW, ZOLA, THE MOST IMPORTANT CYCLE OF VIOLENCE
  • 06:07 THAT AMERICA SHOULD BE FOCUSING ON IS THIS CYCLE OF VIOLENCE.
  • 06:10 YASSER ARAFAT COMES BACK TO "PALESTINE".
  • 06:14 HE PREACHES PEACE.
  • 06:16 HE LIES TO THE WORLD.
  • 06:17 HE STARTS TERRORISM.
  • 06:19 AND THEN, GUESS WHAT?
  • 06:21 HE GOES BACK TO THE SAME THING.
  • 06:22 ABBAS COMES ALONG AND HE PREACHES SUPPOSEDLY PEACE AND BACK TO THE VIOLENCE.
  • 06:26 IT'S THIS CYCLE OF VIOLENCE THAT THE WEST SHOULD ADDRESS.
  • 06:30 I CERTAINLY AGREE WITH YOU.
  • 06:32 AND IT'S SO IRRATIONAL.
  • 06:35 THE ISRAELIS, EVEN WHEN THEY LEFT GAZA,
  • 06:37 GAVE THEM 14 MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF GREENHOUSES ALREADY PLANTED.
  • 06:41 THEY WRECKED THEM AND SO FORTH.
  • 06:43 THE ISRAELIS BEAR THEM NO MALICE.
  • 06:46 IN ALL THE TRIPS I'VE MADE TO ISRAEL
  • 06:48 I NEVER MET AN ISRAELI THAT SAID I HATE THE PALESTINIANS.
  • 06:51 LOOK, IT IS AN OCCUPATION.
  • 06:53 THE OCCUPATION, THEY SHOULD LIBERATE THEMSELVES IS THAT FALSE NOTION
  • 06:58 AND THE BAD HISTORY AND THE BAD RELIGION THAT THEY'VE BEEN EDUCATED ON.
  • 07:01 INDEED THEY ARE OCCUPIED.
  • 07:03 THEY ARE OCCUPIED WITH HATRED, PERIOD.
  • 07:06 THAT'S WELL PUT.
  • 07:08 WE'LL GO BACK TO THE PRISON AND HEAR SOME MORE FROM THIS TALKATIVE KINGPIN.
  • 07:12 WE SAW THAT GAZA WAS LIBERATED.
  • 07:15 BEFORE THAT WE SAW SOUTH LEBANON WAS LIBERATED BY RESISTING OCCUPATION.
  • 07:20 AND WE HOPE THAT THE WEST BANK WILL BE LIBERATED PEACEFULLY, BUT I DON'T THINK SO.
  • 07:29 (KEN) SO, IF IT'S NOT, WHAT DO YOU DO?
  • 07:31 IF NOT, WE HAVE A LOT OF OPTIONS, AMONG OF THEM, RESISTANCE.
  • 07:37 SO RESISTANCE IS AN OPTION, WHICH IS ACCEPTED.
  • 07:42 BUT BECAUSE WE ARE WEAK, THE WORLD NOW MAY SAY THAT IT IS NOT ACCEPTED, IT IS TERRORISM.
  • 07:48 IT IS ACCEPTED RELIGIOUSLY.
  • 07:50 IT IS ACCEPTED AND IT GOES WITH INTERNATIONAL LAW,
  • 07:56 BUT IF THERE IS A VOICE NOW FIGHTING TERRORISM
  • 08:00 WE SEE TERRORISM AND WE DO NOT AGREE WITH IT
  • 08:04 AND WE OPPOSE WHAT'S GOING OUTSIDE THE WORLD IN ANY KIND OF ATTACKING CIVILIANS.
  • 08:11 BUT WE ARE DIFFERENTIATING BETWEEN OCCUPATION AND ANY OTHER THING.
  • 08:16 SO IN IRAQ THERE'S AN OCCUPATION.
  • 08:17 THE RESISTANCE AGAINST OCCUPATION IS LEGITIMATE TO OUR KNOWLEDGE
  • 08:24 AND HERE THERE IS OCCUPATION.
  • 08:26 THE RESISTANCE IS LEGITIMATE.
  • 08:28 IF OCCUPATION ENDS THERE WILL BE NO NEED FOR RESISTANCE.
  • 08:33 (KEN) WHAT'S A TYPICAL DAY HERE IN THE PRISON LIKE FOR YOU?
  • 08:36 HERE, ALL THE DAYS, YOU CAN SAY ALL THE DAYS ARE FRIDAYS OR ALL THE DAYS ARE SUNDAYS.
  • 08:41 THEY ARE COPIES.
  • 08:42 EVERY DAY IS A COPY OF THE PREVIOUS DAY.
  • 08:45 SO ROUTINE IS NOT AN EASY THING INSIDE THE PRISON.
  • 08:48 INSIDE THIS PRISON WE HAVE HERE IN THIS SPECIAL SECURITY PRISON 25 CELLS.
  • 08:56 24 OF THEM WE HAVE 2 INMATES IN EACH.
  • 08:59 THE OTHER ONE WE HAVE 6.
  • 09:02 WE HAVE THIS COURT HERE, THIS SMALL COURT
  • 09:06 IN WHICH WE CAN GO FOR ONE HOUR FOR PHYSICAL TRAINING FOR ANYONE WHO WANTS.
  • 09:13 AND WE HAVE THE ABILITY ALSO TO COME HERE 2 TIMES AFTER THAT EACH ONE AND A HALF HOUR.
  • 09:22 INSIDE THE PRISON WE ARRANGE OURSELVES TOGETHER AS PALESTINIAN SECURITY PRISONERS.
  • 09:29 AND WE HAVE OUR FRIENDS HERE WORKING IN BETWEEN US AND THE ADMINISTRATION.
  • 09:35 SO WE HAVE HERE, WE ACT HERE AS A COMMUNITY.
  • 09:40 WELL, HE SAYS, RESISTANCE TO OCCUPATION IS LEGITIMATE AND THEY'RE A BUNCH OF RESISTORS.
  • 09:45 THEY HAVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY AND SO ON.
  • 09:48 WHAT'S YOUR REACTION TO ALL OF THAT?
  • 09:50 I DON'T SEE ANY PROBLEM WITH THE WAY HE'S LIVING RIGHT NOW.
  • 09:53 HE'S HAVING FULL FREEDOM.
  • 09:54 THEY ACT AS A COMMUNITY.
  • 09:55 THEY STILL COMMUNICATE WITH HAMAS OUTSIDE OF THE PRISON.
  • 09:57 IN FACT, THEY MAKE LEGISLATION, ZOLA, FROM THE PRISON ITSELF
  • 10:00 AND THE ENTIRE PALESTINIAN COMMUNITY FROM THE RELIGIOUS HAKRIM ASABRI,
  • 10:04 THE GRAND MUFTI OF JERUSALEM,
  • 10:06 WHEN HE GOT TOGETHER WITH RANTISI AND ALL THESE RELIGIOUS LEADERS
  • 10:09 TO DECIDE WHETHER THE PRISONERS AND THE INMATES, THESE TERRORISTS,
  • 10:12 HAVE A RIGHT TO HAVE VISITATION RIGHTS WITH THEIR WIVES.
  • 10:15 WHY? SO THEY CAN HAVE CHILDREN, SO THEY CAN FIGHT THE OCCUPATION.
  • 10:18 MORE TERRORISTS. >>YES.
  • 10:21 AND THIS WAS ALLOWED?
  • 10:23 THIS WAS OKAYED.
  • 10:24 THE FATWA CAME AS OKAY.
  • 10:26 IT'S OKAY TO EVEN, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT EVEN VISITING THEIR WIVES,
  • 10:29 BY DOING SOME MEDICAL PROCEDURES TO GET THE, YOU KNOW.
  • 10:32 REALLY? >>YES.
  • 10:33 AND THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY PUTS UP WITH THAT?
  • 10:36 THEY'RE ASKING THE RED CROSS TO FACILITATE THIS OPERATION.
  • 10:40 LET ME GET THIS STRAIGHT.
  • 10:42 THIS GUY IS A MASS MURDERER. HE GOES TO JAIL.
  • 10:44 HE SAYS I WANT TO HAVE SOME SONS SO THAT MORE MASS MURDERS CAN HAPPEN OF INNOCENT CIVILIANS
  • 10:48 AND THE RED CROSS SAYS, BY ALL MEANS, WE CAN WORK IT OUT.
  • 10:51 THAT'S RIGHT. ABSOLUTELY.
  • 10:52 IT'S THE SAME THING WITH SHEIK OMAR ABDEL-RAHMAN,
  • 10:54 THE ONE WHO TRIED TO BLOW UP THE TWIN TOWERS...
  • 10:56 THE GUY IN A WHEELCHAIR, YEAH.
  • 10:57 ...THE FIRST TIME.
  • 10:59 HE WAS MARRIED IN PRISON TO A 12 YEAR OLD GIRL.
  • 11:02 SHE WAS MAKING VISITATIONS TO THE PRISON.
  • 11:06 THE INMATES WOULD TAKE BLANKETS AND MAKE A LITTLE TENT
  • 11:09 SO HE COULD CONSUMMATE HIS MARRIAGE WITH A KID.
  • 11:11 I MEAN, THINK ABOUT THAT.
  • 11:12 THIS IS THE KIND OF SOCIETY THAT THESE PEOPLE WANT TO MAKE.
  • 11:15 I'M SHOCKED. I MEAN, I REALLY AM.
  • 11:18 AMERICANS DON'T KNOW, REALLY, WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE MIDDLE EAST.
  • 11:21 AND THE IDEA OF RESISTANCE TO OCCUPATION.
  • 11:24 OKAY, THE WHOLE WORLD SAYS, OF COURSE, YOU RESIST IF YOU'RE OCCUPIED,
  • 11:27 BUT MURDERING INNOCENT CIVILIANS.
  • 11:29 THAT'S NOT WHAT YOU CALL RESISTANCE.
  • 11:31 LOOK, ZOLA, 113,000 ARABS WERE SURVEYED.
  • 11:34 73% SAYS THAT HAMAS SHOULD BE THE REPRESENTATION TO THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE.
  • 11:40 HAMAS IS RESISTING WHAT?
  • 11:42 THEY WANT TO TAKE THE WEST BANK.
  • 11:43 IF YOU GIVE US THE WEST BANK THEN WE'LL BE FINE.
  • 11:45 THEN WHAT?
  • 11:46 THEN THEY'LL WANT TEL AVIV.
  • 11:48 IF YOU GIVE US TEL AVIV, THEN YOU'LL BE FINE.
  • 11:49 IT'S PIECE BY PIECE.
  • 11:51 IT'S A PIECEMEAL KIND OF THING.
  • 11:52 AS YOU KOWTOW TO THIS KIND OF SYSTEM, GUESS WHAT?
  • 11:56 WE GIVE THEM GAZA, THIS IS THE CENTRAL HEADQUARTER OF HAMAS.
  • 11:59 ONE OF THE SPEAKERS THAT ADDRESSES OUR GROUP, A WEST BANK SETTLER,
  • 12:02 TAKES A PIECE OF PAPER IN THE SHAPE OF ISRAEL AND HE SAYS, PIECE BY PIECE, AS HE TALKS
  • 12:08 AND EXPLAINS IT HE KEEPS TEARING AWAY PIECES TILL THERE'S NOTHING AND THAT'S THE PLAN I GUESS.
  • 12:13 THAT'S RIGHT.
  • 12:14 OKAY, WALID.
  • 12:16 WE'LL BE BACK, RIGHT AFTER THIS.
  • 12:48 FOR INSIGHTFUL PERSPECTIVES ON ISRAEL AND BIBLE PROPHECY,
  • 12:52 ASK FOR OUR FREE MONTHLY NEWSLETTER, THE LEVITT LETTER.
  • 12:55 WHEN YOU CALL BE SURE TO ALSO ASK FOR OUR FREE CATALOG
  • 12:58 WITH THE LATEST VIDEOS, BOOKS AND MUSIC.
  • 13:01 OUR CORRESPONDENCE COURSE, THE INSTITUTE OF JEWISH-CHRISTIAN STUDIES INCLUDES
  • 13:05 READING PACKETS, TEACHING CASSETTES AND MAIL-IN TESTS.
  • 13:09 YOU MAY WANT TO JOIN US ON AN UPCOMING TOUR OF ISRAEL, GREECE
  • 13:12 OR THE HOLY LAND EXPERIENCE THEME PARK IN ORLANDO, FLORIDA.
  • 13:16 PLEASE CONTACT US FOR MORE INFORMATION.
  • 13:18 IF YOU HAD BUT ONE WORD TO DESCRIBE ISRAEL, WHAT WOULD THAT ONE WORD BE?
  • 13:23 INCREDIBLE.
  • 13:24 FULFILLMENT.
  • 13:25 UNBELIEVABLE.
  • 13:27 OH, WOW.
  • 13:28 SHALOM.
  • 13:30 FABULOUS.
  • 13:31 SABABA, WHICH MEANS AWESOME.
  • 13:35 LOVE, THE LOVE OF GOD.
  • 13:39 PHENOMENAL, PHENOMENAL, PHENOMENAL.
  • 13:50 WELL, THAT FOOTAGE OF ISRAEL'S A LOT DIFFERENT THAN THE PRISON, I REALIZE.
  • 13:54 AND THAT'S WHAT YOU GET WITH YOUR TOUR.
  • 13:55 WE DON'T VISIT THE PRISON.
  • 13:57 BUT WE'RE GOING TO VISIT IT AGAIN NOW.
  • 13:59 LET ME RECAP WHERE WE'VE BEEN.
  • 14:00 WE'RE WATCHING AN INTERVIEW OF A TERRORIST PRISONER
  • 14:05 IN A HIGH SECURITY FACILITY IN BEER-SHEVA ISRAEL WHERE, OF COURSE, ABRAHAM LIVED.
  • 14:10 TALK ABOUT AN OCCUPATION, THEY'RE ON ABRAHAM'S LAND, TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH.
  • 14:16 HE MADE A DEAL WITH THE PHILISTINES OF THE TIME ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE.
  • 14:19 OUR COMMENTATOR IS WALID SHOEBAT.
  • 14:22 HE'S BEEN WITH US BEFORE.
  • 14:23 HE WAS ONCE A TERRORIST HIMSELF.
  • 14:25 HE KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT.
  • 14:27 HE KNOWS SOME OF THESE GUYS FROM THE NEWS AND SO ON, BUT HE LIVED WITH THEM ALL OF HIS LIFE.
  • 14:32 HE WAS BORN AND RAISED OVER THERE.
  • 14:34 SO NOW WE'LL GO BACK TO THE PRISONER THAT WE WERE FOLLOWING
  • 14:38 KEN BERG, OUR PRODUCER, WAS INTERVIEWING, ABBAS AL SAYYED,
  • 14:43 WHO IS ROUGH AND TOUGH AND HE MAY BE ON ONE OF THESE KINGPINS TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH,
  • 14:48 INVOLVED WITH A LOT OF VERY SERIOUS STUFF.
  • 14:51 SO, WE'LL GO BACK TO OUR LOCATION TAPE.
  • 14:54 (KEN) TELL ME, IF YOU WOULD, WHAT FACTION OR MOVEMENT, I GUESS, THAT YOU'RE A MEMBER OF.
  • 14:59 I'M A MEMBER OF HAMAS.
  • 15:02 (KEN) AND HOW DID THAT COME TO BE?
  • 15:05 (KEN) AT WHAT POINT IN YOUR LIFE DO YOU MAKE THAT DECISION OR IS FAMILY IS PART OF THAT?
  • 15:11 (KEN) HOW DOES THAT HAPPEN?
  • 15:13 TO BE A HAMAS MEMBER?
  • 15:14 (KEN) YES.
  • 15:15 I AM HERE, A GUY UNDER OCCUPATION.
  • 15:18 I GREW UP SEEING THE OCCUPATION.
  • 15:21 I BECAME RELIGIOUS WHEN I WAS 13 YEARS OLD.
  • 15:28 I THOUGHT OF LIFE AND OF THE WAY LIFE IS GOING ON.
  • 15:33 I BELIEVED IN HELPING MY PEOPLE IN ALL ASPECTS OF LIFE.
  • 15:36 DURING THAT TIME, BEFORE THE FIRST INTIFADA, THERE WERE MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD MOVEMENT.
  • 15:42 I PARTICIPATED IN IT, WHICH IS THE MOTHER OF HAMAS.
  • 15:45 HAMAS IS THE STRONG ARM OF THE MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD MOVEMENT.
  • 15:48 SO I BECAME A MUSLIM BROTHERHOOD MEMBER, AN ACTIVE MEMBER.
  • 15:54 (KEN) WHAT I AM UNDERSTANDING,
  • 15:56 (KEN) YOU WERE INVOLVED IN THIS CLARK HOTEL SITUATION 4 TO 5 YEARS AGO, IS THAT CORRECT?
  • 16:03 (KEN) IN NETANYA - WERE YOU INVOLVED IN THAT?
  • 16:06 I AM ACCUSED OF DOING THAT.
  • 16:08 (KEN) ACCUSED OF IT, YEAH.
  • 16:10 (KEN) WHAT ACCUSATIONS, WHAT ARE YOU BEING ACCUSED OF SPECIFICALLY THERE?
  • 16:15 THAT'S THE WAY HERE AGAINST, WHEN YOU WORK AGAINST THE ISRAELIS, THAT'S THE WAY.
  • 16:22 THEY ARREST PALESTINIAN PRISONERS AND THEY PREPARE THEM FOR TRIAL
  • 16:26 AND THEY PRESENT WHAT THEY CLAIM EVIDENCE IS AGAINST THEM.
  • 16:32 SO THAT'S WHAT, THE WAY IT WENT FOR ME.
  • 16:36 I WAS ACCUSED OF BEING RESPONSIBLE OF THAT ATTACK.
  • 16:39 (KEN) BUT YOU WEREN'T?
  • 16:40 I HAVEN'T SAID THAT IT IS TRUE OR NOT.
  • 16:44 I LEFT IT TO THE COURT TO DECIDE AND THE TRIAL IS GOING ON NOW IN TEL AVIV.
  • 16:50 IT WAS NOT A FAIR TRIAL AT ALL AS I THOUGHT BEFORE.
  • 16:53 BUT TILL NOW I AM GOING THROUGH THE RULES OF THE GAME
  • 16:58 FACING THE ALLEGATIONS AGAINST ME IN A JUDICIAL WAY.
  • 17:04 SO, WE HAVEN'T REACHED THE END YET.
  • 17:06 I THINK WE ARE STILL IN THE MIDDLE.
  • 17:10 (KEN) I GUESS THAT IT'S A FACT THAT IT REALLY DID HAPPEN.
  • 17:14 (KEN) OBVIOUSLY SOMEBODY BLEW THEMSELVES UP.
  • 17:17 I HAPPENED, YEAH, FOR SURE.
  • 17:19 (KEN) THERE MUST HAVE BEEN SOMEBODY IN CHARGE, IS THAT CORRECT?
  • 17:21 OKAY.
  • 17:23 (KEN) BUT THERE'S STILL, IN YOUR MIND, YOU WEREN'T THE PERSON WHO DID IT,
  • 17:28 (KEN) BUT THERE WAS SOMEBODY WHO WAS IN CHARGE.
  • 17:31 I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT MYSELF, EITHER IF I PARTICIPATED OR NOT IN IT.
  • 17:35 I SAID THAT IT GO JUDICIALLY AND IF I HAVE A THING TO SAY I WILL SAY IT AFTER YEARS ABOUT IT.
  • 17:43 BUT, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT? WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT?
  • 17:47 THAT'S A KIND OF OPERATION THAT OCCUPATION MAKES MY PEOPLE DO IT.
  • 17:52 I KNOW EXACTLY ABOUT THE STORY, ABOUT THE GUYS
  • 17:55 WHO ARE BEING ALLEGEDLY ACCUSED AS BEING ENGAGED IN IT.
  • 18:01 I THINK IT'S ONE OF THE MOST CRITICAL,
  • 18:06 MOST CRITICAL TURNING POINTS IN THE CONFLICT BETWEEN US AND THE ISRAELIS.
  • 18:11 AND I DO BELIEVE THAT IT DID NOT HARM OUR PEOPLE STRATEGICALLY.
  • 18:20 WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT, HE SAYS.
  • 18:23 35 PEOPLE BLOWN UP IN THEIR PRAYERS AND KILLED
  • 18:26 AND I DON'T KNOW, A HUNDRED WOUNDED AND A HOTEL RUINED.
  • 18:29 WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT?
  • 18:31 YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND HIS MIND AND HIS PERSPECTIVE.
  • 18:33 WHEN I WAS, PRIOR TO 1993, BEFORE I WAS SAVED,
  • 18:36 I WOULD HAVE SAID THE SAME THING, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT.
  • 18:38 IT'S LIKE YOU CATCHING YOUR CHILD STOMPING A BUNCH OF ANTS
  • 18:40 AND YOU SAY DON'T DO THAT SON AND HE LOOKS AT YOU AND HE SAYS,
  • 18:43 WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT, BECAUSE THESE ARE ONLY ANTS.
  • 18:45 THEY ARE NOT HUMAN BEINGS, YOU SEE.
  • 18:48 WHEN THE JEW BECOMES THE RAT, WHEN THE JEW BECOMES THE MONKEYS
  • 18:51 THAT SUPPOSEDLY GOD PUNISHED THE SABBATH BREAKERS IN ACCORDANCE TO THE KORANIC VERSE
  • 18:58 [ARABIC],
  • 19:00 WE'VE CONVERTED THE JEWS, THE SABBATH BREAKERS
  • 19:02 TO BECOME DETESTABLE MONKEYS, THEY'RE NOT HUMAN BEINGS.
  • 19:05 YOU'RE NOT KILLING HUMAN BEINGS HERE.
  • 19:06 YOU'RE KILLING ALLEGORICALLY MONKEYS AND PIGS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
  • 19:09 SO, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT?
  • 19:10 THAT'S THE WAY HE SEES IT FROM HIS PERSPECTIVE.
  • 19:12 AND THIS IS A STUDENT WHO WAS ADMITTED TO GO TO ATLANTA UNIVERSITY
  • 19:16 TO STUDY IN THE UNITED STATES AND THE USA DOES NOT UNDERSTAND
  • 19:20 WHAT IS WRONG WITH THEIR PROCEDURE BRINGING THESE PEOPLE HERE TO BECOME STUDENTS.
  • 19:24 EMORY UNIVERSITY SHOULD BE MIGHTY PROUD OF ITSELF ALL THESE DEATHS, ALL THIS BLOODSHED.
  • 19:28 AND THEN WHEN YOU ASK HIM ARE YOU INNOCENT?
  • 19:30 IMAGINE, YOU GO TO COURT AND THEY SAY, INNOCENT OR GUILTY?
  • 19:34 THE JUDGE WILL SAY, WELL, YOU DECIDE.
  • 19:36 WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?
  • 19:37 OF COURSE YOU HAVE A PLEA. YOU SAY INNOCENT.
  • 19:40 BUT HE SAYS THIS, I'M NOT SAYING INNOCENT OR GUILTY.
  • 19:42 HE'S GUILTY AS HECK.
  • 19:43 SURE LOOKS LIKE IT TO ME.
  • 19:45 THAT'S NOT THE ONLY THING THIS GUY'S DONE, HE'S RATHER PROUD OF ALL THIS BLOODY WORK.
  • 19:52 HE WAS ASKED, ZOLA, HE WAS ASKED FROM THE BEGINNING, WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU.
  • 19:55 HOW DID YOU JOIN HAMAS?
  • 19:56 IT WAS NOTHING ABOUT OCCUPATION.
  • 19:57 HE JUST KEPT GOING ON THAT I WAS 13.
  • 19:59 I JOINED THE RELIGIOUS SYSTEM.
  • 20:01 AND THEN I BECAME MORE RELIGIOUS AND MORE RELIGIOUS AND MORE RELIGIOUS.
  • 20:05 AND THEN HE STARTED BOMBING BUSES.
  • 20:07 AND THEN THEY BOMBED BUSES EVERYWHERE.
  • 20:09 IN TURKEY THEY BOMBED BUSES.
  • 20:11 THEY BOMBED BUSES...
  • 20:13 ALL THOSE PEOPLE ARE SUB-HUMANS, RIGHT?
  • 20:16 LIKE HITLER SAID. >>EXACTLY.
  • 20:18 THE JEWS ARE SUB-HUMAN, WELL, THESE PEOPLE ALSO MUST BE SUB-HUMAN
  • 20:21 AND THIS KILLER IS A REAL HUMAN BEING.
  • 20:24 AND WHEN THE JEWS RESIST AND FIGHT AND SHOOT TERRORISTS AND KILL THEM,
  • 20:28 THE WORLD CRIES OUT THAT THE ISRAELIS ARE COMMITTING ATROCITIES,
  • 20:30 EVEN THOUGH THE AMERICANS THEMSELVES, THIS KIND OF MENTALITY, ZOLA,
  • 20:33 THIS KIND OF MENTALITY WAS DEALT WITH UNDER NAZISM.
  • 20:36 FINALLY THEIR ALLIES STARTED SHOOTING HITLER YOUTH WHO WANTED TO DIE FOR HITLER.
  • 20:41 THERE WAS NO SOLUTION. THEY STARTED SHOOTING THEM.
  • 20:43 THEY SAID WE HAVE TO STOP THIS NAZISM ONCE AND FOR ALL.
  • 20:46 AND ISRAELIS CAN'T SHOOT TEENAGERS IN THE STREETS.
  • 20:50 THEY DON'T WANT TO SHOOT ANYBODY.
  • 20:52 THAT'S WHAT YOU HAVE.
  • 20:54 AND THE NEW YORK TIMES AND THE WASHINGTON POST AND CNN ALL THE TIMES, THE POOR PALESTINIANS.
  • 21:03 WELL, TAKE A GOOD LOOK AT THESE POOR PALESTINIANS.
  • 21:06 THEY JUST DON'T SEE IT. THEY JUST BECAME RELIGIOUS.
  • 21:07 THAT'S ALL IT IS. THEY BECAME RELIGIOUS.
  • 21:09 EVERY SINGLE TESTIMONY, I SPEAK TO EX-MUSLIMS, THEY BECAME RELIGIOUS.
  • 21:13 WHETHER IT IS FATTAH, WHETHER IT IS HAMAS, THEY BECAME RELIGIOUS.
  • 21:16 THEY WENT TO THE MOSQUE.
  • 21:17 THEY GOT THE FOOD FROM THE MOSQUE.
  • 21:19 THEY GOT THE RELIGIOUS EDUCATION THAT EVERYBODY WHO IS NOT MUSLIM
  • 21:22 IS NOT IN THE SAME PAR, IS NOT EQUAL.
  • 21:25 YOU CAN GET THE SAME TEACHING AT THE MOSQUE IN DEARBORN OR DETROIT OR NEW YORK.
  • 21:29 ABSOLUTELY.
  • 21:30 IT'S AMAZING THAT THEY CALL IT A RELIGION, BUT THEY DO.
  • 21:35 (KEN) DO YOU IN ANY WAY SEE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE SUICIDE BOMBERS
  • 21:40 (KEN) WHO ACCOMPLISH THEIR MISSIONS AND THE ISRAELIS
  • 21:42 (KEN) WHO REACT TO TERRORISM IN THEIR OWN WAY WITH WHAT YOU PERCEIVE AS TERRORISM?
  • 21:50 (KEN) DO YOU SEE ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO?
  • 21:52 WELL, SURE, THERE IS A GREAT DIFFERENCE TO WHAT I SEE.
  • 21:55 WHAT I SEE THAT OUR FIGHTING OCCUPATION IS LEGITIMATE, OCCUPATION IS ILLEGAL.
  • 22:01 THAT'S WHAT I SEE, SO ANYTHING HAPPENS AFTER THAT, IT'S THE RESPONSIBILITY OF OCCUPATION.
  • 22:10 IF A MARTYR WANTS TO EXPLODE HIMSELF, IT IS BECAUSE HE DID NOT HAVE ANY OTHER WAY TO DO IT
  • 22:16 AND HE'S WEAK AND HE DID NOT HAVE A TECHNOLOGICAL WEAPONS,
  • 22:21 HE CANNOT GIVE HIS MESSAGE EITHER TO THE WORLD OR TO THE OCCUPATION.
  • 22:25 HE WAS FORCED TO DO THIS.
  • 22:27 BUT, THE OCCUPATION IS BEING FOUGHT BECAUSE IT'S AN OCCUPATION.
  • 22:31 IF OCCUPATION ENDS, WE DO NOT HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH ISRAELI,
  • 22:33 WITH JEWS AT ALL OR WITH THE CHRISTIANS AT ALL.
  • 22:35 OUR PROBLEM IS JUST WITH OCCUPATION.
  • 22:37 SO, I DO SEE THAT THERE IS A GREAT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE FIGHTER,
  • 22:42 THE FREEDOM FIGHTER AND THE OCCUPIER.
  • 22:44 THERE IS NO COMPARISON AT ALL.
  • 22:47 (KEN) THEY WOULD SAY, ALL THAT THEY'RE DOING IS REACTING TO VIOLENCE INSIDE OF PALESTINE.
  • 22:53 WHY IS OCCUPATION? WHY IS OCCUPATION?
  • 22:55 OCCUPATION HERE IS SINCE IF WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE 1967 BORDERS,
  • 23:01 WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MORE THAN ABOUT 40 YEARS.
  • 23:04 WHY IS OCCUPATION?
  • 23:05 LET OCCUPATION END AND YOU WILL SEE STABILITY IN THE REGION.
  • 23:11 NOW, BEFORE THEY LEFT GAZA, THERE WAS A LOT OF CONFRONTATION INSIDE GAZA.
  • 23:17 WHEN THEY LEFT GAZA, WE SEE NOW STABILITY IN GAZA.
  • 23:21 IF THEY LEAVE THE WEST BANK, I AM SURE THAT THERE WILL BE STABILITY IN THE REGION.
  • 23:25 OUR CAUSE IS FIGHTING OCCUPATION.
  • 23:28 OCCUPATION ENDS, RESISTANCE STOPS.
  • 23:32 WELL, FIRST, HE OFFERS GAZA AS AN EXAMPLE OF STABILITY,
  • 23:36 WHERE THE PARADES OF THESE MASKED MEN WITH THESE HUGE GUNS
  • 23:40 THAT ARE BLOWING UP BOMBS AND THROWING ROCKETS ON ISRAELI SETTLEMENTS AND SO ON.
  • 23:45 IF THAT'S WHAT THE WEST BANK WOULD TURN INTO, HOW COULD ANYBODY BUY THAT, NUMBER ONE.
  • 23:51 AND THEN THIS DRUM BEAT OF OCCUPATION, OCCUPATION ILLEGAL HE SAYS.
  • 23:54 SHOPLIFTING IS ILLEGAL, BUT YOU DON'T MURDER DOZENS OF PEOPLE,
  • 24:00 EVEN GRANTING IT'S AN OCCUPATION.
  • 24:03 YOU KNOW, ZOLA, WHEN I GO SPEAK AT SYNAGOGUES,
  • 24:04 MANY JEWISH FROM THE JEWISH COMMUNITIES SAYS TO ME,
  • 24:07 WE LIKE QOREI, WE LIKE HIM BECAUSE HE REALLY MEANS PEACE
  • 24:11 AND WHAT DOES QOREI SAY AS SOON AS THEY GIVE HIM BACK GAZA,
  • 24:15 TODAY GAZA, TOMORROW, JERUSALEM.
  • 24:17 YES, OF COURSE, THE PRIME MINISTER.
  • 24:19 WE ARE GIVING THE CONFIDENCE THAT THEY NEEDS, ISLAMISTS NEED BY GIVING GAZA.
  • 24:23 GAZA IS CRUCIAL BECAUSE IT'S A CENTRAL CAPITAL OF HAMAS.
  • 24:26 GAZA, YES.
  • 24:28 THE MUSLIM'S ARGUMENT, THIS IS WHAT AMERICANS SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT.
  • 24:30 THIS IS THE MUSLIM ARGUMENT, ALWAYS BEEN, (ARABIC)
  • 24:35 THE ONLY WAY TO BRING PALESTINE BACK TO MUSLIMS IS ONLY VIA GOING BACK TO ISLAM,
  • 24:41 GOING BACK TO ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALISM,
  • 24:43 THAT'S WHY THE MAJORITY OF ARABS SUPPORT HAMAS AND NOT THE PA.
  • 24:48 YOU WERE MAKING A POINT WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT JORDAN, THERE'S NO OCCUPATION THERE
  • 24:53 AND YET...
  • 24:54 AND JORDAN IS A VERY GOOD EXAMPLE.
  • 24:56 HERE IN JORDAN THERE IS NO OCCUPATION AND 61% OF JORDANIANS, ZOLA, 61%,
  • 25:03 THAT'S A VERY HIGH NUMBER IN A SURVEY SUPPORTED OSAMA BIN LADEN.
  • 25:09 THE OTHER 39% ARE BEING POLITICALLY CORRECT.
  • 25:12 OH, YEAH, OK.
  • 25:14 AND WHEN YOU SEE THE NEWS, I WAS WATCHING THE NEWS AFTER THE BOMBINGS IN JORDAN,
  • 25:18 SOME JORDANIAN LEADER CAME ON TV, SHE SAYS,
  • 25:21 AFTER WHAT ZARQAWI DID OF BOMBING US JORDANIANS, WE DON'T SUPPORT HIM ANYMORE.
  • 25:26 EXCUSE ME.
  • 25:28 YOU SUPPORTED HIM BEFORE AS LONG AS HE'S KILLING NON-MUSLIMS, THAT'S THE POINT.
  • 25:33 BACK WHERE WE STARTED.
  • 25:41 THAT'S RIGHT, BUT, YOU KNOW, ZOLA, THERE'S A DAY OF THE LORD COMING
  • 25:44 AND ON THAT DAY OF THE LORD, I CAN SEE FROM JOEL, THE DAY OF THE LORD IS COMING
  • 25:48 AND IT TALKS ABOUT THE PEOPLE IN THEIR RESURRECTED BODIES,
  • 25:51 THAT'S THE BELIEVERS COMING TO FIGHT IN THIS BATTLE AND THEN IT SAYS,
  • 26:05 THE LORD WILL COME AND SOLVE THESE PROBLEMS AND WE WILL BE WITH HIM.
  • 26:09 SHA'ALU SHALOM YERUSHALAYIM PRAY FOR THE PEACE OF JERUSALEM.

Episodes in this series

  1. Koran vs. Bible with Ibrahim Abdullah
  2. On Pain of Death with Ibrahim Abdullah
  3. Born in Bethlehem with Walid Shoebat
  4. A License to Kill with Walid Shoebat
  5. 35 Life Sentences with Walid Shoebat
  6. Cowardice at Princeton with Ibrahim Abdullah

Related Episodes

Zola Levitt Presents
Levitt Letter
Tours
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